Megan’s new podcast is available now! Look for Here After with Megan Devine at this link, or find it wherever you get your podcasts. With new episodes each Monday, it’s time we start talking about grief.
Want more videos and podcasts?
There’s so much to say about grief. To make things better for everyone – grieving people, and supportive friends and family – we need a Grief Revolution. I’d love your support to help make that happen. Please consider joining our Patreon community. Details when you click the button below:
This page contains Megan’s guest appearances on other podcasts. For her podcast, Here After, click here
The Grief and Sexuality Episode: Megan Devine on They Talk Sex
In a culture that doesn’t understand grief, how do survivors of intimate partner death loss navigate their sexuality? Psychotherapist and author Megan Devine offers help with libido, relationships, and shame inside of grief. Listen to this episode of They Talk Sex with host Elle Stanger.
It’s OK to Not Be OK: How to Support Yourself + Others Through Grief with Psychotherapist Megan Devine
Psychotherapist and grief advocate Megan Devine is here to help us all understand and navigate grief better. Will I ever feel normal again? What do I say to someone who is grieving? How can I best support my loved ones in grief? Is there something I should avoid saying? Is what I’m experiencing normal? There are so many questions when it comes to grief, whether you’re experiencing it yourself or trying to show up for a loved one who is in it. All this and more on this episode of PRETTYSMART with Danielle Robay.
How to Carry What Can’t be Fixed – Megan Devine on 4 Things with Amy Brown
What are the realities of life as a grieving person in a culture that expects you to eventually (the sooner the better) return to “normal”? How can journaling help you carry the impossible weight of grief? What does practicing gratitude really look like inside grief? Listen in as host Amy Brown and I discuss these things and more on this episode of 4 Things with Amy Brown.
Grief Feels Like You’re Losing Your Mind. But ARE You? –
Megan Devine on Depresh Mode with John Moe
When a loved one dies, the world can become chaos. Everything has changed. It feels like you are – for lack of a better term – going crazy. How far apart are grief and mental illness? The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual, the standard reference for mental illness, says that if you’re still messed up from grief 6 months after the death of your person, you have something called Prolonged Grief Disorder. Megan Devine, an author and psychotherapist who specializes in grief, says that’s not a problem. Megan rejects the idea that being upset for as long as you need to be is a problem. She advocates recognizing the personal truth and reality of what’s going on inside yourself. Listen to Megan Devine on Depresh Mode with hose John Moe.
Living With Grief In A Culture That Doesn’t Like To Talk About It – Megan Devine on Connecticut Public Radio
We don’t do grief very well in this country. We don’t talk about it, we get uncomfortable around it, and in some mind-twisting way, we hope grief will leave us alone if we pretend it doesn’t exist. But that’s not how grief works. Even professionals trained in grief tend to pathologize it when those living in grief don’t ‘get over it’ or ‘recover ‘ from it fast enough. Today, a hard look at grief, including how to survive it and how we can all better support those who are living in it. Listen to Megan Devine and Nelba Marquez-Greene on Connecticut Public Radio.
Once Upon A Gene: Rare Disease and Grief – Its Ok That You’re Not Ok with Megan Devine
Megan Devine is the author of It’s OK That You’re Not OK, a psychotherapist, a grief advocate and communication expert dedicated to helping people face their toughest experiences. This book, her story and explanation of grief changed everything for me. After this episode, be sure to get a copy of the book for yourself, join her community and check out her new illustrated journal, How to Carry What Can’t Be Fixed. Listen to Megan Devine on Once Upon a Gene with host Effie Parks.
Velvet’s Edge with Kelly Henderson: The Truth About Grief
Kelly talks to psychotherapist and author of It’s Ok That You’re Not Ok, Megan Devine, about the reality of grief. Megan breaks down what grief actually looks like, the truth about moving through it and the biggest trick to dealing with grief. She also gives tips on how to deal with friends who may be going through grief and how to deal with each other as a culture that has collectively gone through so much trauma and grief in the last year. The women discuss the differences in the ways that both men and women process and Megan reveals the one thing we actually all WANT to hear while we are going through the grief process. Listen to Megan Devine on Velvet’s Edge with Kelly Henderson.
Marketplace Morning Report: Stitching opportunity into crisis can erase pain that needs to be felt
From a mass loss of life to economic hardship, the coronavirus pandemic and ensuing recession have caused a lot of pain. Back in July, “Marketplace’s” Kimberly Adams spoke with Megan Devine, a psychotherapist and author of “It’s OK That You’re Not OK,” about how the language of grief can be applied to conversations about economic changes and loss. Adams checked in with Devine to hear how grief is manifesting in the economy. Listen to Megan Devine on Marketplace.
Marketplace Morning Report: How to Grieve the Old Economy
We’re heading into July 4th weekend, but many people might not feel like celebrating as the world and the economy keep changing. Part of that change involves grieving – and that’s all right. Megan Devine is a psychotherapist and author of the book, It’s OK That You’re Not OK. Marketplace Morning Report talked to her about grief and what it has to do with the economy. Listen to Megan Devine on Marketplace.
Grief Encounters: Grieving In The Uncertain Times We Live In with Megan Devine
This week’s podcast is slightly different as we listen to an incredible conversation between Sasha and Megan Devine, who you might remember from one our favourite episodes last year: It’s Okay That You’re Not Okay. Sasha and Megan chatted during an ‘Insta Live’ on Megan’s incredible Refuge In Grief Chanel about grieving in such unprecedented time of our lives. They chat through how to help our friends and family be a support during grief, how we are all being effected at the moment and how we process our feelings, especially in these uncertain times. Listen to Megan Devine on the Grief Encounters podcast.
Take Note: Grief Advocate Megan Devine On Changing How We Think About Loss
Did you watch the PBS documentary Speaking Grief (speakinggrief.org)? Producer Lindsey Whissel Fenton and I talked even MORE about grief on WPSU’s Take Note podcast. In this episode: misconceptions about grief, coming to terms with the fact that our job as support people isn’t about cheering someone up, the problem with comparing losses, why saying “Let me know if you need anything” isn’t actually helpful, and more. Listen to Megan Devine on WPSU’s Take Note podcast.
How To! With Charles Duhigg: How To Say the Right Thing at the Worst Time
Ann’s sister just lost her husband and Ann doesn’t know how to console her. Ann lives in a different state and, having experienced loss herself, knows saying the wrong thing can only add to the hurt. What can Ann do from a distance to make her sister feel better? In this episode of How To!, Megan Devine, a psychotherapist and author of It’s OK That You’re Not OK, says first of all don’t try to cheer them up. Simply acknowledge their pain. Megan learned this the hard way after the sudden loss of her partner in a tragic accident. The classic five stages of grief are problematic, Megan says, because grief doesn’t progress in an orderly fashion. To help a loved one, don’t put the burden on them to figure out how you can help. Instead, anticipate and act on what they need to get by day-to-day. Listen to Megan Devine on How To! With Charles Duhigg.
Most of us feel terrible right now. What can we do about it?
How do we handle the uncertainty of life during the coronavirus pandemic? What’s the difference between loneliness and solitude? And how do we cope with loneliness during lockdown? The ongoing lockdown is difficult for everyone in all sorts of ways and it has an impact on our mental health. Psychotherapist and author Megan Devine talks to WTOP about how terrible most of us are feeling right now and why it’s so important to acknowledge and talk about it. Listen to Megan Devine on WTOP News.
Loneliness, job loss, isolation… it’s a hard time for everyone (ABC7 News)
From loneliness and isolation to job loss to concerns about the safety and health of yourself and your loved one, this is a hard time for everyone in different ways. Why is it important for us to talk about how we’re having a hard time? How do you best support someone who comes to you expressing that they’re struggling? Thank you to the ABC7 News team for having me on the air to discuss the value of acknowledging how hard things are right now, the importance of reaching out to each other, and reaching out to medical providers with specific concerns. Watch Megan Devine on ABC7 News.
The Kathryn Zox Show: Navigating Grief
I had a wonderful time chatting with host Kathryn Zox. We discussed the importance of acknowledgement, finding your middle ground, creating rhythm amidst chaos, the concept of hope, and more. It’s a great conversation. Listen to Megan Devine on The Kathryn Zox show.
Best ways to support each other during the pandemic and other hot messes. Megan Devine on WGN News
Isolation plus multiple stressors can be a recipe for disaster, so how do we actually help others and how do we take care of ourselves? With so much loss and uncertainty in the world right now, it’s more important than ever to remember that we can’t fix each other’s pain and anxiety, but we can reach out to each other and acknowledge it. Thank you to the WGN News team in Chicago for having me on the air to discuss the best ways to help support each other. Watch Megan Devine on WGN News.
Unemployment and Grief: Megan Devine on KTLA5 News
With unemployment reaching staggering numbers, it seems like everyone at least knows someone who’s lost their job. And with so much tied to our jobs – identity, friendships, daily routine, and healthcare – grief and anxiety are understandable responses. Why does offering advice or suggesting that someone “think positively” hinder rather than help and what should we do instead? How can we use this time to explore the connection between work and identity? Psychotherapist, writer, and grief advocate answers our questions about how to cope with job loss amid COVID-19. Watch Megan Devine on KTLA5 News.
Loss all around us: Megan Devine on KPBS Midday Edition
We are all touched at some level by loss in this COVID-19 pandemic — from the loss of our freedom to walk on the beach or connect with friends, to the loss of a job and an income or, more tragically, to the loss of a loved one. The restrictions put on us during the pandemic make the feelings of loss all the more difficult to cope with. Psychotherapist Megan Devine is an author and lecturer who has written about grief and how to help those dealing with grief. Her book is called “It’s OK, That You’re Not OK.” She joined Midday Edition on Thursday. Listen to Megan Devine on KPBS Midday Edition.
Lost your job because of the pandemic? Megan Devine on FOX59
Among the many changes the coronavirus crisis has brought with it, job loss ranks as a top stressor. Millions of people have had their jobs terminated or reduced which can cause a lot of emotions including grief. Pyschotherapitst Megan Devine shares how you can cope. Watch Megan Devine on FOX59.
Looking on the bright side won’t help. Megan Devine on WUSA9
What’s the most helpful thing we can do in the face of all this personal and collective grief? Why is “looking on the bright side” not always helpful? How do we hope in the face of all the uncertainty of the coronavirus pandemic? I addressed all of these things and more in my appearance on WUSA9. Watch Megan Devine on WUSA9.
Better Ways To Treat Heavy Hearts – Megan Devine on Connecticut Public Radio
Grief is everywhere. Whether a loved one has died, you lost your job, your wedding is cancelled… It’s all grief. There are things people say that are meant to help, but can really hurt, so Megan Devine, author of It’s OK That You’re Not OK, has some ideas about how we can all better support grievers. Listen to Megan Devine on Connecticut Public Radio.
The loss of normal life and routine: Megan Devine on Portland AM Northwest
We’re all grieving– the loss of a loved one, the loss of a job, the loss of our normal routines, even the loss of milestones like a child’s graduation. Psychotherapist Megan Devine, author of It’s OK That You’re Not OK, joined AM/NW host Helen Raptis to talk about the losses, both real and intangible, that we’re experiencing right now, along with why it’s completely normal and what we can do to work through it. Watch Megan Devine on AM/NW.
You Can’t Give From Empty – Grief Professionals & COVID-19 With Megan Devine
What happens when a crisis affects everyone, including those who support others? Who is left to show up and care for those who need it the most? Grief professionals are faced with finding answers to the question, “How do we care for ourselves so we can care for others?” Megan Devine is the founder of Refuge in Grief, author of It’s OK That You’re Not OK, and creator of Writing Your Grief online classes and communities. We delve into these questions and explore how the pandemic is affecting Megan, the people she supports, and her colleagues in the grief world. Enjoy this conversation with Megan Devine on Grief Out Loud.
Skillbuilding for grief: Megan Devine on Love Your Work
Megan Devine is the author of It’s OK That You’re Not OK, and runs the Writing Your Grief workshop. It wasn’t until Megan, a therapist, experienced grief herself that she discovered how we as a culture utterly fail to support the grieving. Chances are, you’ve had grieving people in your life. If you haven’t, you most certainly will. Now is the time to build these skills, so let’s get started. Enjoy this conversation with Megan Devine on Love Your Work, Episode 223.
Why the way we understand grief is wrong. Megan Devine on the End-of-Life University Podcast
My guest Megan Devine is a psychotherapist, writer, grief advocate, and communication expert. She is the author of the book It’s OK That You’re Not OK and the creator of an online community, blogs, podcasts, and courses for people dealing with grief. She will share with us how she came to see that our current models of grief support are flawed, what approach she advocates for helping those who grieve and the resources she offers on her website. Megan Devine on the End-of-Life University Podcast.
Rising rates of suicide: Megan Devine on Portland AM Northwest
AM/NW host Helen Raptis and Megan Devine discuss what the rising suicide rate means, and what’s really behind those numbers. Hint: it’s not what you think. Watch Megan Devine on AM/NW.
The most practical episode ever recorded: Megan Devine on Irenicast
Rajeev sits down and has a conversation on grief with author Megan Devine. Grief might be the most universal human experience and Megan shares her personal journey to her work as a grief advocate. She provides wisdom into developing one’s own grief skills, whether they are needed for personal griefs or to walk into grief with a loved one. As a loving act toward yourself, listen to this conversation and take a look at all of the amazing resources Megan has available. This may be the most practical episode we’ve ever recorded. To top it off, Rajeev and Megan play a few rounds of Over/Under. Somehow avocado toast makes another appearance… but that is not the best part. Listen to the end. Enjoy this conversation with Megan Devine on Irenicast.
Talking about grief can still be hilarious. Megan Devine on Grief Encounters
On this week’s podcast Sasha got the opportunity to speak to the psychotherapist, writer, and grief advocate Megan Devine. Since beginning the podcast, Sasha had flagged Megan as the one guest that she wanted to speak to above anyone else, because of the impact Megan’s book had on her while grieving for her mom. Megan was so honest, thoughtful and at times absolutely hilarious with her words throughout this interview, and we really think everyone will enjoy this episode a lot. Enjoy this conversation with Megan Devine on the Grief Encounters podcast.
Anger, grief, and social justice: Megan Devine on Reclaim with Thais Sky
In this week’s episode of RECLAIM I am delighted to be interviewing grief and loss expert Megan Devine. Together we explore the ways in which we can support others who are navigating through grief while honoring their experience, as well as ways that can be hurtful. We also dive into anger, social justice, and how we can hold better space for one another. Enjoy this conversation with Megan Devine on the Reclaim podcast.
The cult of positivity: Megan Devine on The Mental Illness Happy Hour
The licensed therapist shares about the well-meaning but misguided “cult of positivity” after tragedies, emotional dissonance, grief support, having difficult conversations and how she dealt with the sudden death of her partner 10 years ago. Host Paul Gilmartin opens the show with letters from audience members. Megan’s portion begins around the 17 minute mark. Enjoy this conversation with Megan Devine on The Mental Illness Happy Hour.
How western culture misunderstands grief: Megan Devine on The One You Feed
Megan Devine is a pioneer in the fields of grief support and emotional intelligence. Since 2009, she’s been writing and talking about grief and love, shaking up our culture’s ideas about both all along the way. In this episode we discuss these topics along with her newest book, It’s OK That You’re Not OK: Meeting Grief and Loss in a Culture That Doesn’t Understand. Listen in to Megan Devine on The One You Feed.
After Paradise: Day 29. Megan Devine on NPR, talking about wildfire recovery and grief.
Tonight on “After Paradise” – it’s been 29 days since the Camp Fire started. Toxic debris removal from burned out properties has already begun. Now, Butte County is asking fire victims to sign up to allow cleanup of the rest of the materials. We’ll have details. Plus a North State non-profit is giving the Red Cross 100-thousand dollars to help replace medical devices and glasses that were lost to the fire. And Megan Devine, the author of a book about grief, talks about the best ways for friends, family, and coworkers to help victims through the recovery process. Listen in to Megan Devine on After Paradise.
Dealing with Grief (with Megan Devine)
We start the show, as always, with your commemorations. One in particular, along with some listener feedback, lead us into a deeper conversation about birth control and gynecology in general. Then, we share our amazing conversation with therapist Megan Devine about how we deal with grief. [Note: this episode opens with a discussion of birth control by the show’s hosts. My part of the episode begins after the thirteen minute mark. It’s a great discussion, but if the topic is hard on you, skip ahead.] Listen in to Megan Devine on The Nuanced Life.
The Thing I Never Thought I’d Do Again
There is a lot that goes unsaid in grief, particularly when it comes to dating after the death of a partner. Jana talks with Megan Devine, grief thinker, speaker, and author of the audio book, When Everything is Not Okay: Practices to Help You Stay in Your Heart & Not Lose Your Mind, about what comes up when grief and dating overlap. When do you know you’re ready? How do you talk with your children? Listen in to Megan Devine on the Grief Out Loud podcast.
Sleep disturbances and other suffering inside grief: Megan Devine on the Grief Dreams Podcast
Megan Devine is a Pacific Northwest writer, speaker, and grief advocate. She is the founder of Refuge In Grief, a hub of grief education and outreach, where she leads people through some of the most devastating times of their lives. Megan is the author of the new book, It’s OK That You’re Not OK: Meeting Grief & Loss in a Culture That Doesn’t Understand. In this episode we talk about sitting with suffering, coping using the tango, the death of her husband, sleeping issues following the loss, and grief dreams of her husband. Enjoy this conversation with Megan Devine on the Grief Dreams Podcast.
Coping With Grief with Megan Devine
Welcome to episode 20 of the Thriving Leaders Podcast, brought to you by Credence & Co. Today’s conversation is important because it is something that we don’t talk about often enough. It’s something we all experience, we all witness, and we’re all impacted by in some way. Today we’re talking about grief with psychotherapist, author, and the person behind the site Refuge in Grief, Megan Devine. Enjoy this conversation with Megan Devine on the Thriving Leaders Podcast.
So Booking Cool Interviews Megan Devine
Grief can be hard to talk about and that is what Megan Devine has been dedicated to changing. The psychotherapist of nearly 20 years wrote her book It’s Ok That You’re Not Ok: Meeting Grief and Loss in a Culture That Doesn’t Understand, published by Sounds True, and founded her company Refuge In Grief to help society improve the way we acknowledge and support people who are experiencing pain of any kind. Enjoy this podcast with Megan Devine on So Booking Cool.
How should we talk about suicide?
Recent celebrity suicides have us talking about the ways we suffer and hurt in Western culture, and how hard it can be to help the people you love. Enjoy this podcast with Megan Devine and Global Radio’s Kelly Cutrara.
Live from Seattle: a conversation on the border crisis with Michelle Mendoza
What can we do about the crisis facing families trying to enter the US? How do we even begin to talk about the grief involved as we watch these atrocities unfold. Join Megan and host Michelle Mendoza in this important conversation. Note that Megan’s segment begins around the 44 minute mark. Enjoy this podcast with Live from Seattle’s Michelle Mendoza.
It’s OK That You’re Not OK: In Deep with Angie Coiro
This discussion with grief expert Megan Devine is just a revelation. She has both a professional and deeply personal take on the topic. Her book It’s Okay That You’re Not Okay taps not just her own life but the experiences and lessons shared by her clients and website visitors. Don’t expect a somber hour, though. Megan’s got a contagious sense of humor, a key element to her life as it continues to evolve. Enjoy this podcast with In Deep Radio’s Angie Coiro.
Rethinking Our Relationship with Grief
Deep grief or loss is a universal experience. However, our guest, who has lived grief, argues that our cultural models of grief our broken. This hour we explore a different way of looking at grief, tools that help grieving people and those who love them, and ways to build a life alongside grief rather than seeking to overcome it. Rethinking Our Relationship with Grief: interview & call in show with Wisconsin Public Radio.
There is No ‘Right Way’ to Grieve
All of us will experience the death of a loved one in our lives, yet many of us are emotionally ill-equipped to cope with the grief that follows. In this hour, we explore how people grieve and why our culture avoids talking about it. We’ll also look at ways to console people, what to say and what not to say, and how to celebrate the life of a departed loved one. Listen in to this interview and call-in show: Megan Devine & Julia Cooper with WHYY’s Radio Times host Marty Moss-Coane.
Megan Devine on Coming Back, with Shelby Forsythia
An everyday activity turned into a nightmare for Megan Devine who watched her partner, Matt, drown during one of their usual “quick dips” in the river. Her community, Refuge In Grief, and new book, It’s OK That You’re Not OK: Meeting Grief & Loss in a Culture that Doesn’t Understand, are powerful beacons for grieving hearts. We’re talking about the librarians that live in our brains, the importance of having a will, and the bizarre switch from “doing for” a loved one versus “doing in honor” of a loved one. Megan Devine on Coming Back, with Shelby Forsythia.
The Howl at the Center of Grief: Tami Simon interviews Megan Devine
In this episode, Tami speaks with Megan about It’s OK That You’re Not OK and the tragedy that inspired the book — the accidental drowning of her partner. Tami and Megan discuss “the wild howl at the center of grief,” the challenge of shouldering things that only we can carry, and why “letting go” is a myth. The Howl at the Center of Grief: Tami Simon interviews Megan Devine on Sounds True’s Insights at the Edge
Grief, Love, and the Power of Acknowledgment
Megan Devine challenged us to approach life’s challenges differently for ourselves and the people we love in Grief, Love, and the Power of Acknowledgment: Megan Devine speaking at Chris Guillebeau’s World Domination Summit.(video).
Coming Back to Life
In our conversation, Megan pulls no punches when questioning our culture’s approach to grief: Why do we offer platitudes to those grieving, rather than nonjudgmental companionship? How can we better support each other when experiencing tragedy? How do these lessons apply to everyone? We dive into this deeply moving journey in this week’s conversation, and come full circle to explore how she’s found a new place of grace in the world. Megan Devine and Jonathan Fields on the Good Life Project. (podcast)
Spiritual bypass, bearing witness, and why everything doesn’t happen for a reason
Episode #108 of the podcast features Megan Devine the author of “It’s Ok That You’re Not Ok – Meeting Grief and Loss in a Culture that Doesn’t Understand.” Her expressive thoughtfulness and razor sharp opinions on the topic will leave you curious, softer and more accepting of how pain can and should work in ones life. Our conversation could have gone on for two hours – there are so many corners to explore. Megan Devine & Zach Leary on It’s All Happening. (podcast)
The Secret Side of Grief: The Culture of Blame
Exploring the dark corner of grief and suffering: blame. How our brains are hardwired to discharge pain and discomfort with judgment and even disconnection. Megan Devine on the Secret Side of Grief, at Best Self Magazine. (podcast)
Getting grief out of the whisper corner
Megan Devine, writer, speaker, and grief advocate discusses her work to bring grief out of the whisper corner. We talk about how to talk about grief, the death positivity movement, Megan’s book, It’s OK That You’re Not OK – Meeting Grief & Loss in a Culture that Doesn’t Understand, and what she terms the grief revolution. Listen in to the Grief Out Loud podcast.
How to Help a Grieving Friend
watch Megan’s segment on AM Northwest, where she and host Helen Raptis discuss how to help grieving friends and family members:
How can we best help someone who is grieving and in pain?
This is a conversation about grief, about what to do when you lose someone you love, what to do with grief and this new set of never-experienced emotions, and about how to best help friends and family members who experienced severe loss. Great conversation with Megan & host David Noël on the Role Models podcast.
It’s Ok That You’re Not OK: Talking Grief on One Idea Away
Talking about grief can make us uncomfortable. The truth is we all walk around with a backlog of unspoken or unheard pain that we’re afraid to reveal; but why? The TRUTH behind our silence and what we’re really so damn afraid of… Megan Devine on One Idea Away.
Hearing the Truth, Telling the Truth
In this wide-ranging conversation, we discuss how we handle grief so badly in our culture and how to take steps towards improving, how to build a practice of nurturing yourself, creating small moments of personal agency even in out of control experiences, and some deeply thoughtful ways to approach the holiday season. Nurturing Habit with Doña Bumgarner.
Meeting Grief & Loss in a Culture That Doesn’t Understand
Megan is known for her practical, no-nonsense approach to grief, and for her ability to guide people inside some of the most devastating experiences of life and love. While her work is often focused on grief itself, her message is much wider: by acknowledging what hurts, we can all learn to love each other better – no matter what life brings. The Anxiety Podcast with Tim JP Collins. (podcast)
What to Do When Life Gets Messy
Some things in life cannot be fixed. Today’s discussion is about dealing with the raw pain and emotion of things not working out as planned. It’s about telling the truth and not trying to sugar coat everything. Because life doesn’t always happen in a straight line and we need a way to get and give support when bad things happen. The Start Up Sessions with Michael Knouse.
Grief, Love, & the Dangers of Being “Overly-Spiritual”
*note: the actual podcast begins around the 15 minute mark.* Sister Jenna & Megan discuss the pitfalls of leaning too heavily on spiritual ideals when faced with the realities of grief and love. Megan Devine on America Meditating, with Sister Jenna.